What killed small market major leage baseball?

[semipenguin]

Colin Cowherd was talking about how there is no real parody in baseball and that small market teams will never be able to keep up with the larger Markets, like New York and Boston. He even went as far as to say that Kansas City and Pittsburgh are only a minor league town...

IMHO, I think it was the baseball strike of 1994 that really killed baseball in some of the small markets. When that strike end the 1994 season, the Montreal Expos and the Texas Rangers were the best teams in baseball.

Since that year, neither teams have contended. The Expos were moved to Washington and are trying to be passed off as a major league team. The Rangers can contend for the first month or so, but that's about it. After May, they are looking up at .500.

Minnesota won in 1987 and 1991. Made the playoffs in 2002, even went to the ALCS, but lost to the Angels.

Kansas City hasn't done anything since 1985. Milwaukee since 1982. Baltimore hasn't been the same since 1996. Pittsburgh's WS's got derailed by Atlanta in 1991, 1992. Cleveland went in 1995 and 1997 and not since. Colorado went in 2007, but were no match for Boston.

So is baseball in small markets over? Will KC or Pittsburgh ever be able to compete?

I think they can, but it will take owners that want to bring up good players, keep the players, and get quality free agents...

 

[RoadRunner]

See, I don't buy the premise. Last years AL champ was Tampa Bay who won the AL East ahead of both Boston and New York. The big budget teams can afford to pay for mistakes to go away, so there is no doubt they are advantaged. But if a small-market team like the Rays or the Rox doesn't make mistakes, they can compete.

KC and Baltimore are classic models of the bad management/ownership situation. Milwaukee was held back by their long-term ownership by interim-commisioner-for-life Selig. Texas was more crippled by some bad trades than the '94 labor stoppage.

Lots of people talk about how the "parity" of the NFL is responsible for it's increased popularity, but the facts are that given almost any time frame, MLB has crowned more different champions than the NFL has.

 

[Ifandorbut]

Minnesota won in 1987 and 1991. Made the playoffs in 2002, even went to the ALCS, but lost to the Angels.

Kansas City hasn't done anything since 1985. Milwaukee since 1982. Baltimore hasn't been the same since 1996. Pittsburgh's WS's got derailed by Atlanta in 1991, 1992. Cleveland went in 1995 and 1997 and not since. Colorado went in 2007, but were no match for Boston.

So is baseball in small markets over? Will KC or Pittsburgh ever be able to compete?

I've done some studying of what happens from year to year in baseball and from what I've been able to conjure up, in the 1990's the Minnesota Twins were the fourth most successful American League franchise. By success I don't mean ticket sales, I'm talking about winning a division or a Wild Card and winning playoff games, pennants and World Series titles. The Twins rank fourth behind two other small market teams in Cleveland and Toronto. The number one American League franchise in the nineties was the New York Yankees.

In the National League the rankings have Atlanta at number one, followed by Cincinnati, Florida and San Diego. Florida is a small market team, but the year they won it all, they were anything but a small market team salary wise.

Small market teams can compete and do well, but like another poster mentioned, their room for error is smaller comparatively to the bigger market teams. The Yankees should always be in the discussion by the end of the decade once the facts are figured in when talking about "team of the decade", and the way they're able to do that is within the revenue stream they have at their finger tips.

Kansas City and Pittsburgh and other small market teams all make good money from the luxury tax that the bigger market teams pay when going over their ear marked salary level.

I think what Colin Cowherd was referring to wasn't so much the idea of not being able to make it as a franchise, but that certain something that is lost for the fans in small market towns, that something called hope. There really isn't a lot of hope for the small market teams that come October they will be enjoying their team vying for the top spot among the leader board. That can have a huge psychological effect on the fans from small market towns everywhere.

 

[semipenguin]

I've done some studying of what happens from year to year in baseball and from what I've been able to conjure up, in the 1990's the Minnesota Twins were the fourth most successful American League franchise. By success I don't mean ticket sales, I'm talking about winning a division or a Wild Card and winning playoff games, pennants and World Series titles. The Twins rank fourth behind two other small market teams in Cleveland and Toronto. The number one American League franchise in the nineties was the New York Yankees.

In the National League the rankings have Atlanta at number one, followed by Cincinnati, Florida and San Diego. Florida is a small market team, but the year they won it all, they were anything but a small market team salary wise.

Small market teams can compete and do well, but like another poster mentioned, their room for error is smaller comparatively to the bigger market teams. The Yankees should always be in the discussion by the end of the decade once the facts are figured in when talking about "team of the decade", and the way they're able to do that is within the revenue stream they have at their finger tips.

Kansas City and Pittsburgh and other small market teams all make good money from the luxury tax that the bigger market teams pay when going over their ear marked salary level.

I think what Colin Cowherd was referring to wasn't so much the idea of not being able to make it as a franchise, but that certain something that is lost for the fans in small market towns, that something called hope. There really isn't a lot of hope for the small market teams that come October they will be enjoying their team vying for the top spot among the leader board. That can have a huge psychological effect on the fans from small market towns everywhere.

It would be hard for me to think of Toronto as a small market team. Toronto has over 4 million people living there. That's 5th behind Mexico City, New York, Los Angeles, and Chicago. They should be one of the highest in fan attendants every year.

Minnesota is still one of the best teams every year and have won the Central Division 4 times since 2002. And they're one of the teams thought of when Bud was talking about Contraction...:shock:

Cleveland is one of my favorite teams. I need to add them to my list of favorites. I forgot, though...

I think if it wasn't for the collapse of Seattle in the mid 90s, the Yankees would not have won as much as they did in the late 90s, and we wouldn't have talked about them as the Team of the 90s.

I hope you're right about Colin Cowherd (sorta). He was right when he said that Tampa didn't draw flies until August. Small market clubs need to support their teams better...

 

[Ifandorbut]

It would be hard for me to think of Toronto as a small market team. Toronto has over 4 million people living there. That's 5th behind Mexico City, New York, Los Angeles, and Chicago. They should be one of the highest in fan attendants every year.

I think if it wasn't for the collapse of Seattle in the mid 90s, the Yankees would not have won as much as they did in the late 90s, and we wouldn't have talked about them as the Team of the 90s.

Seattle had a hell of a ball club, but they were not able to keep the likes of the Big Unit and Junior. If they had the new park a good decade earlier, what you say might have turned out to be true, but they Yankees still would have placed very high. The only decades the Yankees were not the American League team of the decade was in the 70's when they lost out to Oakland and in the 80's when they were sixth behind Kansas City, Oakland, Detroit, Baltimore and Minnesota. The Yankees dominated the 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's and 60's.

 

[Ifandorbut]

An addendum to the last post:

Although the decade still has another year of stats to crush, the standings thus far, from my retarded formula is...

American League
1) New York Yankees
2) Boston Red Sox
3) Anaheim Angels
4) Chicago White Sox

National League
1) St. Louis Cardinals
2) Arizona Diamondbacks
3) Philadelphia Phillies
4) Atlanta Braves

Florida is close, but the Braves have nudged them out.

A mixed league representation would be...

1) New York Yankees
2) St. Louis Cardinals
3) Boston Red Sox
4) Anaheim Angles
5) Arizona Diamondbacks
6) Chicago White Sox
7) Philadelphia Phillies
8) Atlanta Braves

 

[semipenguin]

A mixed league representation would be...

1) New York Yankees
2) St. Louis Cardinals
3) Boston Red Sox
4) Anaheim Angles
5) Arizona Diamondbacks
6) Chicago White Sox
7) Philadelphia Phillies
8) Atlanta Braves

I'm becoming more and more of a Cardinals fan. They have only gone to the World Series twice since 1985, but they always make the best of what they have, and won the WS a couple of years ago...

 

[Ifandorbut]

I'm becoming more and more of a Cardinals fan. They have only gone to the World Series twice since 1985, but they always make the best of what they have, and won the WS a couple of years ago...

They've won their division six times since the 2000 season. They've won their first round playoff series five times, the pennant twice and the series once. That's why they've scored the highest for NL teams this decade.

The Yankees have won their division seven times, they have one wild card appearance, they've won their first round playoff four times, they have three pennants and one series win. That's why they are the team of the decade...AGAIN.

The Yankees would have to not make the playoffs next year and the Cardinals would have to get to the pennant for the Cardinals to become the team of the decade.

 

[Jon]

Teams like the Minnesota Twins are always in it till the very end, despite miniscule payrolls and always losing their players to the bigger market teams. Their organization is run very well, and I only hope a team like the Rockies (who I follow) can learn from theirs and the Athletics examples. Big Market teams spend money like drunken sailors, but how many World Series have the Yankees won since the year 2000? Enough said.

 

[goreds2]

Teams like the Minnesota Twins are always in it till the very end, despite miniscule payrolls and always losing their players to the bigger market teams. Their organization is run very well, and I only hope a team like the Rockies (who I follow) can learn from theirs and the Athletics examples.

Hopefully, the Reds can follow this starting in 2009.

 

[craigiecubsfan]

Hopefully, the Reds can follow this starting in 2009.

Don't count on it. The Cubs WILL win their first of 6 consecutive World Series crowns this October.

 

[goreds2]

Don't count on it. The Cubs WILL win their first of 6 consecutive World Series crowns this October.

Good to hear from you again. Good luck.