Mark Martin is on the pole!!

dpkimmel2001

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He went from being on the pole to on the fence. Hendrick better give him the bullet proof car for the next race. I think when his crew gets to Bristol, they better rip those decals off of Johnson's or Gordon's cars and replace them with their own. :yesshake:
 

DexterMorgan

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Oct 22, 2008
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In that race in 1990 that Mark was penalized, Mark was penalized 46 points but he was still scored as the winner. That whole mess was something shady of epic proportions. It had to do with a carbeurator part. Id need to do some research to find some facts about it, but from memory it had to do with this part.

As a lifelong Martin fan, I dont blame Nascar for costing him the championship. Nascar being shady is what they do. But that team had the points lead in command downing down the stretch and they choked. All Martin fans remember how they went to test at Atlanta and couldnt decide between a Yates car and their own piece. Dale came to the test and ran one lap, loaded it.

Another not so famous incident was when Dale and Mark had a press conference and Dale was mentioning how he and Mark were going to go fishing and have a bunch of beers. The idea behind that was that Mark was a recovering alcoholic so Dale was preying on that. Thats just one of the examples of Dale's behaviour and why karma is a bitch.
 

dpkimmel2001

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In that race in 1990 that Mark was penalized, Mark was penalized 46 points but he was still scored as the winner. That whole mess was something shady of epic proportions. It had to do with a carbeurator part. Id need to do some research to find some facts about it, but from memory it had to do with this part.

As a lifelong Martin fan, I dont blame Nascar for costing him the championship. Nascar being shady is what they do. But that team had the points lead in command downing down the stretch and they choked. All Martin fans remember how they went to test at Atlanta and couldnt decide between a Yates car and their own piece. Dale came to the test and ran one lap, loaded it.

Another not so famous incident was when Dale and Mark had a press conference and Dale was mentioning how he and Mark were going to go fishing and have a bunch of beers. The idea behind that was that Mark was a recovering alcoholic so Dale was preying on that. Thats just one of the examples of Dale's behaviour and why karma is a bitch.

It was a carburetor spacer that was a half-inch too thick. It was illegal. It happened at Richmond and NASCAR would have no idea that the penalty would have any implication on the championship. They didn't wait until the end of the year to assess the penalty.

Press Conference info with alcohol related comment.....

The day before the race, NASCAR brought Martin and Earnhardt into the tiny PIR media center for the obligatory two-races-to-go-in-the-championship press conference. Right at the start, Earnhardt said something to the effect, of, "Hey, Mark, tell you what we should do: Forget the fans, forget the TV cameras, forget the media, you and I will go to Atlanta, race for 50 laps, come in and do a shot of whiskey, run 50 more laps, do another shot and keep going until one of us drops. Last man standing wins."


Martin turned white as a ghost. He had battled insanely hard to make it back to the then-Winston Cup Series, after having to sell off his own team when a sponsor flaked on him in 1983. After that, Martin had gone home to his native Arkansas, won another ASA title
and cleaned his act up considerably, losing both his youthful cockiness and some of the bad habits that went with it. He gave up alcohol altogether and became one of the most devoted fitness fanatics in the garage, traits he maintains to this day.

And here was Earnhardt, throwing demon alcohol back in Martin's face and taunting him with it. It was cruel and unusual punishment for a guy who didn't deserve it.

And it worked, just as Earnhardt knew it would.


Full story here....... NASCAR - JENSEN: Where's The Hate? - SPEEDtv.com
 

riskybzns

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It had to do with a carbeurator part.

it was an illegal (non-performace enhancing) carburetor spacer, and cost mark/roush the championship by 26 points.

remember nascar also docked mark points the last time stewart won the championship, which wouldn't have played an outcome in the final.

daytona 500, 2007, martin was ahead of harvick when nascar brought out the yellow flag, yet nascar didn't freeze the field at that point causing mark a victory.

personally, if i knew the rules stated that the field is frozen when nascar brings out the yellow and nascar uses video to determine who is ahead when the yellow flag is out, i would have backed out of the throttle when my crew chief came over the radio and said, yellow's out.
 

dpkimmel2001

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Yes, it must be a conspiracy! Why would NASCAR want to let one of the most 'well liked' drivers win the championship? Maybe it's Roush! They just don't want him to win a championship! Dang, I wonder why they would let him win with Matt and Kurt and not Mark?
 

DexterMorgan

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As I said Id have to do some more research into the subject. But from memory there was a reason why the part was the way it was. There is a story I remember about Childress complaining to Bill France Jr about it. But I cant for the life of me remember why the part was thought to be legal, but then wasnt. I think it came along the lines of the Dover 2005 Hendrick shock deal. It was legal, and then a rule came out saying it wasnt. Where the part Martin's team used wasnt technically illegal at that weekend, but the next week there was a change in the rules. Again thats from memory.

Let me tell you something about the 2007 Daytona 500. All the Brian France shills, all the Mike Helton, John Darby, and Robin Pemberton shills out there. All the people that say these guys do a great job yet cant tell me 3 things these guys have done good for this sport. For those people, you can look at that race and wonder why I think of these a**holes the way I do. For a sanctioning body that preaches "saftey". Its a bunch of bull. Everytime I hear a host, a commentator, some corporate shill say, "Nascar's first priority is saftey" Its a bunch of bull.
 

riskybzns

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would have been kinda hard to deny matt the championship when he was spankin the rest of the field with his big point lead and 1 win...oh wait, what happened after that, nascar changed the point system format into the chase. juney and gordo didn't make the cut that year, and next year nascar changed it from 10 chase drivers to 12.
 

DexterMorgan

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Yes, it must be a conspiracy! Why would NASCAR want to let one of the most 'well liked' drivers win the championship? Maybe it's Roush! They just don't want him to win a championship! Dang, I wonder why they would let him win with Matt and Kurt and not Mark?

Well remember DP, Roush was new one of the most disliked car owners at that time, and Mark was a new up and comer vs. the worshipped Earnhardt who had legions of fans. Martin didnt have anywhere near the fanbase he does now, and Roush was 10 times the loud obnoxious loud mouth he is now. It wasnt a conspiracy as it was more, Roush didnt know how to play the politics.
 

dpkimmel2001

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Back to the original topic..... You can't be saying that by penalizing Martin after the second race of the season that NASCAR would have a clue that that penalty would have an impact on the championship.

Also, I'm joking about Roush as well. Do you really believe that NASCAR has it out for him and that's why he was penalized in 1990? Couldn't have been just as simple as it was, an illegal part? People get penalized all of the time. Only, that year, it help cost the team a championship, 9 months later.

Do get me wrong, I like Mark Martin. I hope that he can win a championship.
 

dpkimmel2001

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Well remember DP, Roush was new one of the most disliked car owners at that time, and Mark was a new up and comer vs. the worshipped Earnhardt who had legions of fans. Martin didnt have anywhere near the fanbase he does now, and Roush was 10 times the loud obnoxious loud mouth he is now. It wasnt a conspiracy as it was more, Roush didnt know how to play the politics.

I have to agree to disagree on this one. I just don't buy into all of this conspiracy stuff. This kind of stuff can go in so many different directions. If it is legions of fans that make the difference, my driver would have at least one championship by now.

As far as Roush goes, 10 times..... I don't know, he can still be pretty loud an obnoxious. LOL
 

DexterMorgan

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As I said, I dont blame that penalty for costing them the championship as much as I blame the team for choking.

I really do believe that Roush's lack of playing politics has cost him the benefit of the doubt with Nascar, as opposed to people who know how to play the game. It happens in all sports and that goes back to the "Nascar favors Earnhardt Jr" argument. They will give their superstars that extra benefit over some rookie, or newcomer. It happens in all sports not just Nascar. And at that time Martin and Roush were new comers who didnt know how to play the politics.
 

DexterMorgan

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I agree with that statement. It sucks for Mark but he did loose points at the end of that season to DE.


Correct. Like for god sakes they were leading the thing going into the 2nd last race. They pitted for tires at Phoenix running 4th while Dale was leading. Dale wasnt going to lose that race but Mark was still a solid top 5 car. They pitted for tires, made a bad adjustment and finished 9th. Then the whole Atlanta debacle. They ended up using a Yates car, which wasnt built like a Roush car and they had electrical issues in practice and had trouble figuring out the problem because it wasnt their car. Cost them practice time, and he finished 6th while Dale finished 3rd.

I dont even want to get into the whiskey comment Dale made, but as looking at where both men are right now, karma is a bitch.
 

dpkimmel2001

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Well the other end of that question is, if it doesnt give them an advantage, why would they run it?

Could it have been something as dumb as the nose clip that Robby Gordon used last year? I suppose it was a mistake. I don't know. There are other examples of penalties were a team supposedly did not have an advantage. I'm not going to keep looking all of this info up but I know that there have been cars that weren't to spec in the past and they've been penalized.
 

dpkimmel2001

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I dont even want to get into the whiskey comment Dale made, but as looking at where both men are right now, karma is a bitch.

Just keep in mind, we are talking 20 years ago. I know that I didn't live in such a politically correct world like I do today. I'm not trying to defend him but it's a little hard to sit here today and judge someone or something that happened in 1990 with the info that I have on that subject.